Staff Changes

I’m sure a lot of you have questions, so I’ll try to give you as much information as possible. Gedan is no longer on the team, I’ll go into why shortly.

Firstly, an apology is owed to Fenoxo.Β  His endorsement rested on Gedan being part of the team. He feels this has made him into a liar. I completely understand that, though I completely did not understand until a short while ago. It was thoughtlessness on my part. My only defense is that at the time of that endorsement, I wasn’t considering a new programmer. Regardless, Fenoxo’s well within his rights to withdraw his endorsement. I have every intention of earning that endorsement back, but it will take some time, as I’m sure it will for a lot of you.

So, Gedan’s no longer working directly on Carnal Souls. This is not something I have taken lightly. Changing staff halfway through a crowdfunding campaign never looks good. Backers and fans will understandably worry, people will want to withdraw, I get it. But I think the benefits of my decision outweigh the losses, and while waiting until the campaign was over to make this change would have meant no loss of funds, it would have been a shitty, dishonest thing to do.

The bottom line is this: I will be working on Carnal Souls full time, I want a lead programmer working on it full time with me, or as close to that as possible. I don’t want to have to fight Fenoxo for Gedan’s time. Roughly 66% of the entire Indiegogo money is to hire a programmer, and I am obligated to get as much out of that as possible. That’s not my money, that’s yours, and you’ve entrusted that to me to spend properly. Gedan is an excellent programmer with experience with these games, but it’s my feeling that Carnal Souls needs it’s own fully dedicated team if it’s going to come close to reaching its goals. And, for the record, I fully intend to pay Gedan for the work she’s done so far.

Gedan has the skills and experience, just not the time I think Carnal Souls needs. So, after I was able to find someone with all the time AND skills we need, I made the decision. It’s my sincerest hope that Fen, Gedan, and I can still collaborate in the future. My respect for them and their experience hasn’t changed one bit, and I value their input a great deal.

I’m sure some of you want to know about the replacement programmer. He goes by Crimson, and he’s been professional software development for nearly 20 years. Game development has been a long time hobby of his, and he sees this as the perfect opportunity to start on it more professionally, especially given that in many ways, Carnal Souls is architecturally similar to things he’s made before. The last game he worked on in his spare time had a hex-based map (like the one we’re planning), and he’s written call-scripting software which is basically branching dialogues for real life conversations. He’s also done back-gate and time tracking software and ecommerse sites, so web development is well within his expertise too. If you have any questions for him or want to quiz his knowledge, feel free to ask away in the comments.

The only downside I see to hiring him is that at such short notice, he’s unable to cancel his Christmas plans with family, and I wouldn’t really ask him to anyway. Which means code streams will resume early January, but we’ll have game art streams in the mean time from some stellar artists, and I’ll also be posting updates about content. What I can pay him is a lot less than he’s used to being paid, but he’s interested in the game enough to want to do it anyway. I absolutely believe that Carnal Souls is going to benefit from the change. Not only that, I think CoC and TiTS will too, without me always wanting to pull Gedan away to work on CS.

I think that about covers everything. I don’t want any animosity between Fen, his team, fans, or us. I think both Carnal Souls and CoC/TiTS can only benefit from us all collaborating and exchanging ideas, and it’s my hope that one day we can.

Thank you to everyone who’s read this far and waited before getting a refund. If you still want one, you are well within your rights to do so and I’ll be happy to provide them. That being said, I have complete faith that Carnal Souls will happen. Again, if you’d like to ask Crimson any questions, feel free to do so in the comments here. At the time of writing he’s away, but he’ll be back in a few hours.

The next stream should be tomorrow around the same time as usual, about midnight GMT, with Boosterpang drawing some lovely dirty Marley.

49 Responses to “Staff Changes”

  1. anon says:

    Without Gedan no way would I back this, was considering it, but…not going to now. So many good games fail half way through, Gedan’s name brought a lot more credibility than some may think.

  2. Alternative Compound says:

    Will there be an android version by any chance?

    • Benji says:

      Yup. It should be playable on android via browser or a downloadable version so you can play offline and avoid data charges.

  3. Zanzuki93 says:

    Don’t worry benji as long as you can make the game you want i am fine with it. πŸ™‚ Also totally not trying to be a kiss ass but that is how i feel. I would not know the difference in the programmers sorry gedan and crimson so it made no difference to me

  4. Sarnak says:

    I understand the need, and can only respect you more for being willing to make the call, and for informing us, the people watching the development of this game (and in some cases putting money towards it), as to what your decision is, your reasoning, and how you plan to move forward.
    In English: thank you for your honesty. I look forward to the continued development of Carnal Souls, and wish everyone a very Merry Christmas.

  5. Zachrym says:

    I’d love to see some of Crimsons past work, not the commercial stuff for the obvious reasons but the other things.

    With Gedan we knew precisely what we were getting. Crimson is an unknown atm.

    • Benji says:

      I understand. There’s not a lot I can offer right now, but once he gets back from his vacation I’ll be showing off everything he can do as much as possible.

  6. Osteoporozis says:

    You’ve still got my money and support, you just keep doing your thing! It’s actually pretty awesome that you were able to find someone with not only the skills to do the job but also genuine interest in the project.

  7. art926 says:

    I don’t understand all this noise about the programmer replacement. I’m a programmer myself (C++ mostly), work in Silicon Valley and have lots of experience. These games don’t look that difficult to me at all. The only difficult part here can be the actual platform or engine that you use (like Flash or html5 + java scripts) which may need some deep knowledge. But it’s not any unique skill and a programmer can be replaced in this case. Do what you think is right, don’t listen to anyone. Just be sure that the new guy is trustworthy and really can do what he claims. Ask him to write code clear and flexible enough, so you could edit it yourself at any point if he leaves. When all main mechanics are implemented in the game, it will not be about programming anymore anyways, it will be only about filling it up with a content, which you can do.

  8. pmv says:

    Quite ironic actually, I have not heard of this game untill I read the rant on Fenoxo’s website. Looks like another sleepless night (week?) ahead πŸ™‚

  9. 59% of bacon is consumed on weekdays says:

    I don’t understand the anger.

    A) People don’t retroactively become liars when things change. If I tell you where my cat is right now and she moves in twenty minutes, what I said before is still just as factually correct and truthful.
    B) He could have pulled his formal support without throwing a temper tantrum. Says more about him than anything.
    D) Lastly, and most importantly, Gedan’s getting paid.

    Like, you’re not four friends working on a mod for funsies and suddenly cutting someone out because they can’t put in as much time as everyone else. This is a job. You have responsibilities. It’s up to you to manage the resources and make sure that you don’t put out a Spacebase DF-9. Kind of blows my mind that everyone is getting their panties in a knot because you made the objectively right call.

    As the person handling the money, hiring someone who is just as qualified, who can do the same job for the same pay – but has more time to devote to the project and doesn’t come with the risk of potential scheduling conflicts is exactly what you SHOULD do.

    • Random Guy says:

      I do fortunately(?)

      (A) You’re right but the case here isn’t that simple. His promise was that the game would be good because Gedan was working on it and informing him about it and henceforth , he had faith in the game being of high quality. With the firing of Gedan, this initial premise becomes false. Gedan is no longer working on the game and informing Fen about it. Henceforth, he no longer has the same faith he had in the game before due to that lack of info. As a result, his promise of “this game will be great because A and B,” when A and B are gone, doesn’t hold. That’s probably why he thinks this could make him a lier.

      (B) Yes but he also COULD have done far worse. People are emotional creatures and we tend to make rash decisions. If this says anything about him, more than anything, is that there’s a human behind that computer screen. Honestly, he apologized for his previous posts and pulled them back. That’s more than you’ll get from most humans these days honestly. Especailly the angry ones.

      (C) No quarrel’s here, except that I don’t think this is one of the reasons that Fen is mad for. He is getting paid though, so that’s a plus.

      All in all, do I defend Fen and say he’s done nothing wrong? Nope. What about Carnal Souls guy (sorry don’t know ya)? Nope. This is just an explanation for his salt. It’s not as irrational as the post above may make it seem. No offense to ya bacon

  10. Nechrom says:

    From the information given to us this seems like the right decision. If you can hold yourself and your employee(s) to the fact that it’s a full time project, it will be that much better for it.
    Projects like these by people who haven’t handled similar things before, with wrangling; co-workers, the community, budgets etc often fail at the management side of things.
    Convincing customers and potential customers that it’s all going well is a difficult thing to do. What helps to ease people’s minds most effectively is regular updates. If it is indeed a full-time project, then you should provide some sort of dev-log regularly. Smaller daily ones or weekly summaries. Streams are great, but that only gives a peek into what is going on right at that moment. For all people know, the rest of the time you could be doing everything but working on the project.
    It’s not so much about proving to critics that you’re working on it, but creating a transparent relationship with your customers/community when it comes to the actual project.

    I think a good role model for this method is Chucklefish, the guys behind Starbound. Their game would probably be dead at this point were it not for their fantastic communication.

    That’s the only thing you can do to create trust. Promises only goes so far.

  11. Xavier says:

    I had concerns about Gedan being split so many ways. That said I also have concerns about the new programmer who hasn’t worked on sex games before and is apparently accepting a much lower salary than they’re used to. Makes me think they’ll get bored in a few months and bail. Gedan at least has a reliable track record.

    Time will tell.

    • Benji says:

      I don’t believe that you can only make sex games if you’ve made them before. Every studio or team has a first game. And for the record, Crimson will be on a contract. This is a job, not a favour I’m asking of him.

  12. Derpy says:

    To be honest – your reason sounds kinda odd to me. This kind of game shouldn’t be too heavy on programming – especially for someone who’s been (successfully) working on this kind of game before. I’d almost wager that Gedan would be able to reach as much part time as someone who has to do solve all related problems for the first time. Even when you’re a very experienced programmer – doing something new will always take you some more time.

    My second point is: I’d expect this game to be much heavier on the art/content side (creating dialogs, scenes, artworks, gui elements…) than the programming side. With only one content creator – wouldn’t a part time developer be more than sufficient? After all, once the framework is done it should be mostly content creation – and you usually don’t introduce new gameplay elements that require programming every five minutes…

    I had planned to back this project with 60 to 100 bucks – but I’m currently thinking about joining the backers once the basis is done and you start your patreon…

    I absolutely hope this project succeeds, though. It really sounds almost too awesome to be true…

    Btw I’m also still wondering how much content will be missing from the offline version of the game (How important will unlockable artwork be in the game? Just a mere bonus? Or will some scenes just have no images that would otherwise be there? Is there a chance for an offline version for backers?)

    I’m undecisive ^^

    Wish everyone involved all the best! Really hope this will turn out great!

    • Benji says:

      Thanks for being polite. I understand some of your concerns, but a lot of these seem based almost entirely on assumptions.

      “This kind of game shouldn’t be too heavy on programming – especially for someone who’s been (successfully) working on this kind of game before.”
      Genre does not equal structure. Carnal Souls has a whole lot of systems that were new to Gedan, and some of them have never been done in any game before. The parser and transformation systems are probably the only significant systems Carnal Souls shares with CoC/TiTS, and even then they are wildly different. The combat system, quests, the hex-based world map, gender and stature alignment systems, the bestiary and journal, weapons and gear and the skills they grant – this is all new stuff, and the list goes on even further. Gedan’s experience does count for something, of course, but suggesting it makes Carnal Souls just more of the same work for her couldn’t be further from the truth. And, furthermore, while Crimson hasn’t made a text-based porn game before, he has done a lot in the past that gives him experience that Gedan does not have.

      “I’d almost wager that Gedan would be able to reach as much part time as someone who has to do solve all related problems for the first time.”
      You’re saying that Gedan is so good that she can handle any Carnal Souls coding task in half the time any other developer can. I’ve never disparaged Gedan’s ability, but she’s not Code Jesus. Again, Carnal Souls presents brand new challenges to her as well as anyone else working on it. ‘Coding’ is not a single, universal skill. There are dozens of languages, libraries, platforms, architectures and deployment methods, and every programmer has their specialities. ‘Porn game’ isn’t one of those. Flash development and Web development alone are vastly different.

      “Even when you’re a very experienced programmer – doing something new will always take you some more time.”
      That I completely agree with. And, again, Carnal Souls involves more new ideas than old ones. That learning curve applies to anyone I hire for the job, Gedan included.

      As for your second point, my priority right now is to make Carnal Souls a fun videogame that works and is well-planned and thought-out to be expanded upon as we go forward. We could have all the good stories and art, but if the game doesn’t work or is crap, it’s only going to get in the way and spoil the content. But if the game is fun and runs great, we can focus on expanding content knowing that it all works together nicely.

      And for the last part, unlockable artwork will be made as a kind of visual bonus at the end of some scenes. The offline version of the game will likely have the art and everything in it, but obviously won’t have the online features, and it’ll be available as a download to backers and above.

      I hope this has cleared up some of your concerns. We wish you the best too, and we’re more confident than ever that Carnal Souls will turn out awesome.

      • Derpy says:

        Hi Benji! Thank you very much for your thorough answer!

        You are definitely making some valid points there. Of course my concerns are only speculation – I’m not a part of the team after all πŸ˜‰

        I do have some vague ideas since I’m a professional programmer myself – but I haven’t developed a game yet (planning on it though ^^). Most of the challenges you list seem to rather stem from game and gameplay design than from pure programming. But there is no doubt a capable developer and clean code can work wonders towards efficiently tweaking and enhancing features.

        By the way – I am not really familiar with Gedan or her work (especially not the internals like code quality etc…). Whom you hire to realize your ideas is also absolutely up to you. I just think the timing wasn’t quite perfect. I’m glad though that you chose to announce it well before the end of the campaign – and kudos for your honest and open communication.

        It’s also great to hear from Chrimson himself – he seems like a perfect fit for the project.

        I am confident that this game will turn out great!

        It’s great to hear that the offline version will be feature complete (i.e. with the art) – I hope there won’t be a change of plans down the road. I think Fen’s project is a good example that games like this can well exist without locking content away – after all there is a dedicated community that wants to see these games realized and expanded πŸ˜‰

        Also I have just pledged 100 bucks. That’s quite a huge amount of money for me so I hope this project will be successful and around for a long time πŸ™‚

        P.S.: I there any chance that Stereo Plair will provide chibis for the game? They are too cute ^^
        P.P.S.: I also wish the best for Gedan – while such situations are always hard to deal with I hope you’ll all get along again eventually!
        P.P.P.S.: Sorry for the wall of text ^^

        • Benji says:

          Thanks very much! Every contribution really helps. I’m glad you feel you can support us, and I’m going to put every penny to good use.

          Stereo may well provide some chibis for the game. You are absolutely correct, they are too cute. :3

  13. zul says:

    Welcome to the new programmer, we all know that the field of sex games is sparse, we only have to win with new programmers coming in, stop the harsh, Gedan is a god, but she is only one, we need more. Good lucky Crimson.

  14. NyuVixen says:

    *Duct tapes herself to the game* Guess i’m along for the ride. :3

  15. Dellison says:

    Regardless of Fen’s rant I’m sticking with Carnal Souls. More than a few of Fen’s fans would have no doubt pulled their funding as a result. He didn’t discourage those that commented about pulling funding from the game either, which is odd when you consider he claims he wants the game to be made. :/

    • Benji says:

      We did see a good few pull out right away, but honestly I expected a lot worse even if everything had been amicable, which was my intention. I have no qualms with people wanting to pull their support because of the change, everyone is well within their rights to do that. I’d prefer it if they had their own reasons rather than simply because they were told to, but it’s ultimately their decision.

  16. Xatarias says:

    I’ve given pretty much what I can financially, and my social media resources are pretty meager (crippled further by the fact that this part of my life is… Private?)

    That said, I really don’t approve of the way Fen handled the staff changes and I’m worried about how his actions will impact the campaign as a whole πŸ™

    So… Is there something more we can do besides throwing more money at you?

    • Benji says:

      The support really helps, monetary or otherwise. <3 Honestly right now the best thing you can do is keep being supportive and vocal about it. I'm still figuring out some new promotional methods to get the word out and reach people who haven't yet heard about Carnal Souls being a thing.

  17. Utility says:

    I will most likely end up supporting your campaign, though it would have been preferable to see a piece of the game created by Crimson (something equivalent to the recently released menu screen) before deciding. However, as a fellow programmer I understand that this can not be done on such a short notice and in these times of Christmas.

    I’ll settle for a question to Crimson instead: Do you intend to keep the current Haxe/CreateJS stack, or do you have something else in mind for the game?

    As for Gedan, though she may not be the cause of it, I must say that I never found CoC and TiTS to be shining examples of good coding practices. Quite the opposite, in fact. Didn’t CoC end up being unmaintainable for this reason? The structure of the code behind the Carnal Souls menu screen looked pretty decent however, so it may be that the poor code in these cases can be attributed to other people.

    In any case, I wish you good luck and hope you manage to deliver something we’ll all enjoy.

    • Crimson says:

      We’re moving back to Unity, which you may have already read about in my introduction post. The short of it as that there was already more working code present in the original Unity prototype of Carnal Souls. As of Unity 5 (or really slightly before that), games made with the engine can be played in browsers without a plugin. There weren’t any advantages to the Haxe/CreateJS route other than the game being playable without a plugin, and that’s a moot point now.

      I’ve worked with CreateJS in the past and found it to be troublesome in many ways. From what I understand, Gedan wasn’t thrilled with it either. There are definitely better libraries available for HTML5 games. My biggest concern with the HTML5 route is that it involves more hands-on effort in ensuring the game will work across all modern browsers. We want to squeeze as much forward progress as we can out of our 6-8 month timeframe and modest budget. Unity saves us time in that regard.

      Again, there’s a bit more detail in my introduction post. I’m confident in the direction we’re headed. I’m going to do all I can to make sure our backers share that confidence very early in the project and all the way through it. It’s regrettable that the Christmas holiday is taking me away from this until after the campaign closes, but I’ll do everything I can when I return to make sure all of our backers feel good about supporting us.

  18. Mustang Flex says:

    Kinda bummed that Gedan’s not working on this, but still hopeful about this game being completed.

  19. Belrose says:

    As a fellow Englishman I still have faith in you. I’ve seen similar things happen to the kickstarters I have and you’re showing the same signs of someone who loves what they’re doing and wants to be a Game Parent. I’m in for a penny in for $20 USD πŸ˜‰

  20. NearLandLight says:

    Just wanted to add my two cents to this discussion lol. So from what I’ve seen and after seeing how Fen acted I still support this fully, I always loved CoC but when he gave up on it for TITS I wasn’t really impressed, not because the game is bad it’s pretty good but I prefer fantasy type games and the fact that there was a fantasy type of adult game was even better. After hearing about Carnal souls I was extremely excited to see what this game had in store for me and all the others who are waiting patiently on the edge of their seats.
    Personally I understand everyone’s human and that I shouldn’t necessarily be mad at Fen but I think as another person in the business of this type of game he could have handled that much better then throwing a tantrum and trying to pull all of his support back. Now he’s well within his rights to do what he wants but that goes for everyone who plays his games or is currently watching what your doing. We all have our own self will and him saying to not support you isn’t going to affect me because of one person not being on the team. After all were all human, though my personal support is currently going to Carnal Souls.
    I think your post made genuine sense and you have to think about these things in the long run, I mean I don’t know Gedan well enough or whatever her work is besides CoC and TITS but someone who can only work part time on this game and has to kind of work on both TITS and Carnal Souls would have been extremely difficult to get anything done. I think it’s a smart move and I’m eager to see what Crimson can do with this game.

    Now after rereading this wall of text I feel that I got my point across hopefully lol, no hard feelings against fen or gedan but I personally want to see what Carnal Souls will be and am here for the long run. Good luck ^-^

  21. Vaeraun says:

    Hmm. Came across this indiegogo about a week back. Was pretty excited at first, but for one reason or another I was leery of pledging just yet, having been burned from a few failed projects in the past and wanting to see how well this one would be received and what hopes of being completed it had first.

    Then this happens.

    As has been said before, Gedan Had led a good deal of credence to the project considering her prior history and work; we all know what she can do and can count on her. The new guy is a complete unknown on the scene, and while he may be an awesome programmer, prior history in the scene counts for much more.

    Will still probably pledge, but do so much more conservatively at this point.

    • Benji says:

      I understand. I’m confident we can show that it was the right choice to make, so if you feel you want to wait until that confidence is restored, I won’t begrudge that in the slightest.

  22. akosi says:

    Fen really let his ugly show with that post. You’re trying to do what’s best for your game, and wanting someone who can dedicate themselves entirely to your upcoming project makes sense, rather than, like you said, hiring someone who already has a big project on their hands. You said you’d try to get back in Fen’s good graces, but I don’t see why you’d want to, honestly. Maybe because you’re trying to be the bigger person unlike him.

    Fen feeling salty and betrayed is all his own fault. He should have thought things through before blasting you all over based solely on Gedan working on the project. Sounds like you were here for business and he wasn’t. None of this is your fault and you trying to pick up the pieces and make amends despite his prissy behavior and attitude is commendable.

    I still have high hopes for this, and will back it as soon as I get paid.

    • there are varieties of beer, vodka, and bourgon that are bacon flavoured says:

      Yeah, seems like he’s really let his e-fame get to his head.

      • akosi says:

        I was thinking the same thing. Perhaps having a huge game that brings in thousands a month had him forget the hard decisions smaller game devs have to make. Now he’s making it sound like Benji was being the bad guy or something by saying he’s read the chat logs and that Gedan could have handled the project just fine. Honestly, I don’t think she could have. CS was introducing new material and mechanics, it would have been way too time consuming. It would have been a fight for her attention and I don’t blame Benji for wanting to find someone else.

        I’m glad I ended my patreon pledge with him long ago. What I would pledge every month to Fen will be going to Benji.

  23. Space urta says:

    I am neither supporting or condemning fenoxo’s or benji’s actions because I have not read fen’s apparent “rant”, but it seems people are being really vicious to fen, and according to one of the people in the comments,”he let his e-fame get to his head”, but if you say that, you obviously don’t know what it’s like, not saying he hasnt, but what do you expect, fame is probably very difficult to deal with. If you get the best, what do you expect to get next time you get something, you expect “the best” more and more often. Also humans are rash, emotional, creatures, so if you say you wouldn’t let fame go to your head your a liar or you have let the same thing you are talking about happen to you.

    I also don’t blame benji’s decision to replace gedan with another person, it’s his/her choice and he’s/she’s doing the best thing he can to get his game done and done in a way that satisfied everyone.

    Sorry for the rant-y thing I just did

    • akosi says:

      Saying we’re all human and whatnot does not excuse his behavior. Justin Bieber is famous and has let fame get to him so does that excuse him spitting on his fans with a smile on his face, and street racing under the influence among other stupid things? No, it doesn’t. Donald Trump is famous and has let fame go to his head so does that excuse the racist and xenophobic things he says daily? No, it doesn’t. The excuse that we’re all emotional creatures that too often think emotionally rather than rationally is no excuse for the way Fen handled things. As he said himself, he rewrote a reply to the situation a few times before settling on something “less explosive” while boasting that if he really wanted to blast Benji and bring Carnal Souls down, he could, so it wasn’t like he wasn’t thinking straight and got caught up in the heat of the moment.

      Truth is Fen jumped into things without really knowing a thing, only backing CS because Gedan was on it. Now he’s crying like he’s somehow a victim in all this and painting Benji out to be the bad guy.

      The salt in the wound about this whole thing is the fact that he’s nearly went on a smear campaign about Benji, told people to pull their pledges and then has the nerve to say he still hopes the game gets made.

      I get wanting to have your friend’s back, but this is just childish tantrum throwing on Fen’s part.

      • Space urta says:

        My point is you shouldnt condemn a person for how they made there decisions unless they are Hitler or something and that fame is harder to deal with than you think, sure, fen was wrong in how he went about it, he also apologiser for it from what i heard. But you can’t condemn him for endorsing because of gedan being on the team, people are unpredictable, he could have just as easily been like “whatever”, but he didn’t because that’s not how he felt

        • Space urta says:

          By the way I’m not diagreeing with you, what fen did was wrong, but don’t rip out his heart (I don’t think I’m saying that right but you know what I mean)

        • akosi says:

          I’m not “ripping his heart out” and I have yet to see anyone unreasonably angry with him. He acted out of line and now he’s being criticized for it. Simple as that. A lot of what people have said about him are on point and aren’t calling him names or something.

          He can apologize all he wants but that doesn’t erase what he’s done. I accept his apology to a degree, but one little post to apologize for the dozens of passive aggressive things he’s said seems half-assed. I’m not asking for his head on a platter or a five page essay as to why he’s sorry, but that was just weak. To me, he’s apologizing not because he feels bad for what he’s done or how he did it, but because he doesn’t want to hear the criticism anymore. He hasn’t learned a thing and will likely do it again sooner or later.

          There’s what, 50 comments here and from just a quick scroll I can see that most, if not all, are done in a respectable manner. No one’s calling Fen names or “condemning” him and proclaiming him to be as worse as Hitler. You’re exaggerating and painting people here to be the aggressors when we’re not.

          But it’s whatever at this point. If you’re not disagreeing with me and not choosing sides, then why are you still posting? lol.

          • Space urta says:

            I just don’t want things to get vicious, I probably worded it Wong, and knowing the internet, small things can turn into a big controversy if not handled well

  24. Space urta says:

    It’s not like fen is the only person in the whole world to have done what he did

    • Space urta says:

      I just don’t want this to turn into a fan war, don’t be so vicious to eachother is what I’m saying, and people are definitely vicious on both sides

      • Derpy says:

        I definitely agree with you! We are basically talking about one “scene” here and I don’t think any good can come from trying to divide it and creating opposing fronts.

        Imho the initial heated reaction is quite understandable (though not desirable of course) – he was passionate about it and with a friend of his working on the project there was also quite a bit of personal investment. Of course he got very emotional when things didn’t work out as expected! Maybe it’s hard to understand when you’ve never been through such a situation – but it’s surprisingly hard to deal with and you (i.e. I and maybe you too) tend to react immature shortly after the event.
        I was once kicked out of a band for creative differences – and I was immensely pissed and my reaction was pathetic (not too harmful – but I ended my friendship with them and acted hurt and stuff and today I’m really sorry for it because they hadn’t deserved it and I kind of hurt them because of my pride and emotional reaction).

        To cut a long story short: We know now that Fen can get quite emotional. And it’s okay! He’s not a PR guy or a spokes-person so he should be allowed to act unprofessionally. But we are no sheep – we should be able to deal with it and see his reaction in context. His reaction was not ideal – but I don’t think we should be mad at him and create a divide within the scene!

        Just my two cents πŸ˜‰

        • akosi says:

          You keep talking about fanwars and a divide but the only one to have started such a thing was Fen. He literally told people to stop supporting Benji and CS, and passively threatened to torpedo his game while being fake and saying he hopes the game succeeds. Clearly you’re fans of him, so lets stop pretending because you refuse to face the facts. All you’re doing is trying to justify his stupidity. 90% of what you post is just excusing Fen and his behavior. “…was not ideal..” You can’t even call his behavior shitty like it clearly was, all you do is sugarcoat it like a white knight lol